#023 - Alien Nation 1.17 "Real Men"

0:01 Humans and aliens working together. I really want to dig more into their culture. That's a mirror up to humanity. Social commentary through allegorical storytelling. Wild, angry old man opinions. Well, you just can't do all the things you're used to doing. Things tend to upset you more. Don't tell me how I feel. You make it sound as though I'm some weak compass female, George. If you had your lead supplements today, the. Poor guy, you know he's doing his best. Back pain, wall and ankles ringing in his ear, frequent urination and emotional outbursts.

0:29 So then he grabs George and I'm like, no. Albert, these are Halloween decorations. I think colorful. It's a baby shower and and the flamingos are supposed to be storks. I thought these were prettier. Hey, what are you talking about? Like guy from out of that stuff. I don't care about that. Whatever. Napkins, whatever. Hey. Lame. Put on this outfit. Come on. Be a cop for a seat. Really. You guys? Yeah, go ahead. What is the? Point of this Who is this for? That is one ugly baby. You're definitely a terrible person.

0:57 Horribly offended, so these are dark times indeed. George Francesco is one of my all time favorite characters. The show is going to go to places that I really enjoy. Sour milk is a good thing to the tank the knees. Stay tuned listeners. Wheel of press kit. Yikes, Sykes. We're both fans of Star Trek. Watching Alien Nation and we enjoy. It I am one of your hosts, Todd, this is Nick. This is the Alienating Ourselves podcast. Greetings humans and newcomers and welcome back to Alienating Ourselves, the podcast where we examine sci-fi entertainment with a focus on aliens and the humans that stick their whole hand in the lean pod flap when that's the only way to get the baby out.

1:33 I am one of your hosts, Todd. Something that happens in the last few minutes of this episode justifies my personal policy of always wearing AT shirt under a sweatshirt or even under a button up shirt. Basically, I never leave the house without 2 layers, and joining me, as always, is a guy who might be more secure in his manhood than I am. It's Nick. Nick, how's it going? It's going really well. Yeah. On a, in a competition of more secure, I'm usually going to lose. I I think I have one pink T-shirt just in case someone does a random Komen Day thing.

2:08 But the gentleman who show up in the collared Tees, I'm like, gosh, you're confident? I like show tunes too much, honestly. So yeah, questioning things. Let's get into it. Today we're looking at Alienation's 17th episode, Real Men, which originally aired on Monday night, February 19th, 1990. We're going to talk a little today about what makes a man a man and how much that's totally made-up and bogus based on what society says. This episode was directed by John McPherson and written by Diane Froloff and Andrew Schneider, who are all three kind of an experienced dream team for production on this show.

2:49 It feels like Diane and Andrew are in the background producing and advising on every episode and are kind of like showrunners with Kenneth Johnson. George is starting his second trimester, although the whole thing may only take 6 to 9 weeks, and it's making him Moody and sensitive. Just when Matt's already self-conscious about having a pregnant man as his police partner, his skeezy friend Nick from Chicago visits to hit on Kathy and make fun of everything, so Matt's even more insecure than usual.

3:17 He gets to talking to George about what makes a man a man, and they both get so insecure that they start stupidly posturing. While all this is going on, gym dudes are feeling inadequate compared to stronger newcomer men, so they start taking dangerous St. steroids. Albert is throwing Georgia baby shower, Susan's a busy breadwinner, and it all comes to a head. So that's just what's going on in today's episode. What was your first response to this episode, Todd? Well it's definitely a great episode and I would say it's still no matter what one of the series best episodes, but I am just a little bit disappointed that it wasn't even better.

3:58 I've been kind of reserving some of my higher, somewhat high scores, like I haven't given out but one or two A's and I still haven't hit the A+ yet because I keep thinking that that A plus and more A's are ahead. And this was one of the episodes that I thought would get there and a little bit of spoiler for my grade at the end, but it didn't quite make it. And again, still one of the best episodes. But I think it is demonstrating 1 consistent little issue I have with the show is that I absolutely love certain iconic scenes, and obviously I love the character of George Francisco.

4:38 But it's just week after week. Sometimes the cop stuff gets in the way. And sadly this episode, as good as it still is, is an example of that problem. So how about you? Well, the parts with Kathy and Matt and Matt's obnoxious friend made me incredibly uncomfortable, but I think I liked everything else. Some of this episode was extremely dated with the bodybuilders at the gym. I'm going to mention that a few times. But some was super progressive, even for today, and that was great. And like last week's episode, I think the reason you thought this was going to get an A is just because the last 10 minutes are ridiculously strong.

5:18 Maybe even the last five minutes, it's just shockingly good. So you're like, wow. And the rest was, you know, OK. So this is my general take on it. We can start with our sour milk, our positives. What's your first positive, Todd? OK, and it's going to be kind of an obvious one, but Eric Pierpoint's performance as George Francisco is amazing, as usual. And this time we get to see yet another side of George, and this time is kind of a combination of upset and vulnerable, but at the same time kind of funny.

5:54 And in fact, I'll have a little bit more to say about this later when I do my little segment where I take some information from the unofficial companion to Alienation, the one of the a book that I got for Christmas. And apparently that was a little bit of an issue in the writers room too. Just how far to take the the humor and whether they were going too far. Kind of like making fun of pregnancy in a way. But still, I love the overall performance and Eric Fairpoint continues to deliver. Well, in my first one is pretty much the same thing.

6:26 It's he gets to be a Moody, emotional pregnant man. And yeah, this could be played for laughs, and I guess it is sort of, but maybe it's because of the gravitas he's bringing to it. Most of it isn't funny. You're just empathizing because he's a really good actor. So he's crying at work and we're I'm not chuckling at that. I'm like, oh, you poor man. And Matt's of course, so uncomfortable. But so he has this scene on the couch at home and he's he's lying lying down on the couch at home trying to read a magazine.

7:02 Well, now he can't reach his plate of snacks. So he gets up in a huff with his pregnant tummy, throws his magazine and gets his plate of snacks. He's eating it off his belly like an Otter. And now he can't reach his magazine and he and he calls Buck and I do love they found something to do with Buck. So once it's family related, once it's baby related, Buck is flourishing. He is thriving. So he runs down the stairs and crouches next to his dad. What is it dad? Do you need something? Dad? Do you want Vaseline for your frog legs?

7:33 He says excitedly. George asks for the magazine and he's like, fine dad, you know, he's just so excited for his dad having a baby. But Susan comes in and a sort of Mr. Mom sequence where she's working hard while he's at home putting his feet up. She's been out late. George is mumbling about how good time for the family, You know, she's having a blast in her professional life. And she comes in the door and he immediately asks her if she'll sit down and rub his feet. And she has that look on her face, like, are you kidding me?

8:07 Like, I just got out the door. But she tells him that, you know, I forget sometimes that you're not really yourself right now. You're, you're a little bit more needy. You're a little bit more. And he gets horribly offended. Aren't. They at the office. No, it was wonderful. I couldn't have asked for a better day. You're never going to believe why it didn't. With one of the most influential humans in the United States, Yes. Buck told me Nemo, my feet hurt. Could you massage them? Of course, George, I'm sorry I get so caught up with work I forget that you've changed.

8:43 Changed but. It's not your fault, you're just more dependent, more needy right now. Needy. Well, you just can't do all the things you're used to doing. Things tend to upset you more. Don't. Tell me how I feel. You make it sound as though I'm some weak, helpless female. Females aren't weak and helpless, George, if I. Wanted I could fall off a Cliff and sew myself up. George. If you had your lead supplements today. This is just a snapshot of like, what Eric Pierpoint gets to do in the episode. And it's just adorable.

9:12 And that whole sequence is probably 3 minutes, but it's, it's a lot of things like that that's just, yeah, it could be, I guess there could be people watching it laughing. But I'm just like that poor guy, you know, He's doing his best. Well, actually, I'm so glad that you brought up everything that you just did, because that was another positive I had for the episode that I actually kind of forgot to put in my notes. That was a laugh out loud chuckle moment when he he did the whole thing with the magazine and the food and he puts down 1 to get the other.

9:44 And so he's he's still not a position to get up and has that asked, but that that was genuinely funny. So I did enjoy that. So I'm glad that you caught it because I forgot to put in my notes. But my next positive is about Matt and Kathy. It is nice that Matt finally tells Kathy he likes her. I mean, when they had the whole mutual admission that they kind of undress each other with their eyes and previous episode, I mean, in a way that was an admission, but that was more just the superficial physical side that finally tells Kathy that he likes her.

10:24 And granted, that is a simple statement. It kind of sounds almost middle school the way he says it. But to be fair, it is clear and more straightforward communication than we sometimes get from Sykes. And that's really all he needs to say. And it is a next step and a big step that we've been waiting for. And I think in in previous episodes where we've seen hints at it, it's like Matt is trying to deny it. And this is a big step in. He's not trying to deny it anymore because not only does he actually admit it to her, but then he does get jealous when his friend dates Kathy one night.

11:05 And I think he even kind of admits it to George. So it's it even Matt is realizing he can't hide this anymore. And so this is a big development, even if the words behind it are simple. Yeah, I I can't think of any examples off the top of my head, but the thing where the man is not going to admit that he has feelings for somebody. It might be the woman to the lady character might that finally they're just so uncomfortable. Like we never promised we were going steady or exclusivity, but it's really making me clearly grumpy that you are hanging out with this other person as like a a storytelling thing.

11:44 Yes, that was that was at least, you know, at least we had some forward progress. But yes, that was the was that the very last second of the whole episode? I think it was like they got it in under the. Wire. Yeah, it was, yeah. So, yeah, barely. So the thesis of this episode and I, I do love it when an episode has a thesis. They have the writers have some sort of idea that they're coming back to. And the thesis of this episode is by being so fixated on gender identity and chasing a fake version of gender pushed by society, that you actually lose sight of your own gender identity.

12:28 And we're lucky enough to live in a time when men and women are a little less stigmatized for wanting to exist in spaces previously reserved for the other gender. George and Matt act overly macho at parts in this episode, which we can see makes their lives more difficult, and in the end they seem to embrace who they are. And for Matt, that means that he likes knitting. Now, I like knitting and I mean, I'll I'll tell the story about knitting later if it's conducive, but I like that Matt learns to knit from his uncle Jack, who he found out about in episode 8, Contact.

13:01 Matt hates his dad, and he saw his now deceased Uncle Jack as a real father figure. And the idea that Uncle Jack was a sailor, which our society does designate as one of the most manly kinds of men a lot of the time, maybe too manly. And then Uncle Jack was the one who taught him to knit because sailors would have skill sets like that. It kind of just goes to show how artificial our concepts of masculinity are. So by the end, Matt is like, you know what? Yeah, I like to knit, and I'm not ashamed of it.

13:31 And it's still, by our society standards, kind of odd to see him knit. But, yeah, George is like, in his culture, there's all these things that he can enjoy with pregnancy, and he's not enjoying them because he's trying to act macho. And he says it toward the end, like, I'm not even enjoying my pregnancy. So yeah, that was cool that they had a thesis and they kind of kept coming back to it. And it extends to the actual crime spree thing going on. Yeah. Yeah, I like it when you apply the idea of a thesis to episodes, kind of implying that certain episodes have a certain point or, you know, just something that they're trying to prove and that there is, you know, a basis behind the episode.

14:19 You know, I won't give it away, but there's another TV show that we might be talking about soon. I don't know, we need to kind of finalize plans on that. But if we do talk about it, it's ATV show that's on now that sometimes I watch. And I'm like, what is the point of this? Who is this for? Why? Why am I watching this? And so that is a show that sometimes I don't think really has a thesis. And so I'm glad that this show has a thesis. And then just one totally random observation. We're talk about knitting socks.

14:46 That reminds me of a scene in an episode of Stargate Universe where Colonel Young is knitting some socks. Now, granted, they're stuck on a ship light years away from home, and so they're limited on supplies, so it's not like he could. He has backup socks. So that's part of the reason it's necessity. But is it? It is interesting to see a military person have that skill and it not even be a big deal. So let me see. Sometimes I save these kind of concepts for the miscellaneous section, but sometimes I move them to positive.

15:19 And that is the tinctonies, biology and culture that we get in an episode. And I've got 5 bullet points, but I'm betting that I missed one or two. So I'll do a few and then you might want to take a turn. So let me see. George is only in phase one of his pregnancy and then in the middle of the episode, he almost immediately goes to phase two. But I'm not sure that they imply exactly how many phases they're supposed to be. They say in one part of the episode that he has three weeks to go. Then I think later he mentions to somebody that it's 2 1/2.

15:55 So I don't know if when they said three if they were rounding up or whatever, but it I get the impression that maybe George's time is of being pregnant is definitely less than a human woman's. Which makes sense to a certain degree because Susan had to carry the pod first for a while before George got it. But still, I can't help but wonder how long did is each person in a pair supposed to have it? George has back pain, swollen ankles, ringing in his ear, frequent urination and emotional outbursts.

16:30 And some, if not all of those actually mirror a woman's symptoms during pregnancy, if I understand correctly. And then pregnant. Think the knees. Men have something called ahavacada, I think. And of course, Matt mispronounces it as Avocado, but it has something to do with how high the baby is in the pouch. So those are just a few things. I got a couple more, but I thought I'd let you take a turn in case you have something in this category too. So yeah, the Heffa cotta just rose. So I think that's kind of like in our anatomy when a pregnant woman will say that the baby has dropped, so it like moves into a lower position and it actually takes some pressure off of, I think maybe your bladder, but it's like you're already in one kind of discomfort and now it's harder to breathe.

17:23 No, it takes pressure off your diaphragm so you can breathe better. But now the baby tends to be dancing around on your bladder, but it's like the the actual baby belly might seem a little lower or something. So a newcomer men, it's the opposite. And the Hepacotta, your Hepacotta just rose. So the the pod actually moves up and like even Matt is like, Hey, is that higher? So yeah, I think your timeline is pretty accurate. I think when the episode starts, his HEPA Cotta hasn't rose yet, so he's not in his last stage.

17:55 So he thinks he has three weeks left. And when it does rise, now he's in that final stage and he has 2 1/2 weeks left supposedly before it naturally ends. But yes, that's I did. Like George says that newcomer men, some of them don't even consider themselves fully a man until they have a baby, which just. Matt was just floored by that. He's just, like, staring off into space. Susan asked George if he's had his lead supplements today. If any of you don't know listers, we've discovered the hard way that lead is not great for humans.

18:31 So yeah, that's another unique Physiology thing. I think that's all I have. That's physiological, but yeah, OK. What's your Part 2? Yeah. I like how this show kind of takes the opposite of what's good or bad for a human and says it is bad or good for for Tanktonese, kind of the way we've already found out that they need a lot of UV radiation and of course is bad for us and they need lead and that's bad for us. And then what was the other thing I just thought of? Oh, there's another example and I I lost it.

19:06 But yeah, it's basically the oh, well, actually we were talking, you were talking about the position, the baby and how for a woman it drops, but for a tinctonies man it rises. So yeah, it's kind of the the equal but opposite reaction for tinctonies. Yeah. George calls Susan Nemu more than once in the episode. Now Graham. Both times are pretty close together, but I like that that happened because it means I'm not crazy. I wasn't imagining things when in a previous episode I thought he called her Nemu because she calls him Nemu quite a bit.

19:39 And so this really does confirm that it is a term of endearment that can apply to both genders. And then lastly, one more thing about the pregnancy. I think these baby can get breached and need manual help to turn around just like some human babies do. And I kind of implied that some during my my as usual, weird intro. So a man's pouch opens upward. And so Matt had to stick his whole hand in to turn Vestna around. And so thank goodness he was there, because. Even if George could have done it, he passed out at that moment.

20:17 They owe a lot to Matt. As much as he might be annoying sometimes and screw up sometimes and and maybe even still be a little bit prejudice, at least he's, you know, steps up and does what he has to in the in a dire moment.

20:32 That whole breach thing, I think. So that's a good segue for one of mine. And that's just to talk about the end and what I was saying about roles and how we see roles. So it just, it gets me how shocking this episode is in how brave it is with pushing some boundaries. And the way that it ends is just great. So in the last scene when George goes into labor early like you said because they're having the struggle in the gym, it really made me nervous because the guy who's going after them is super popped up on steroids and he literally grabs Matt and punches him in the stomach like 3 or 4 times in a row.

21:17 So then he grabs George and I'm like no, but luckily he just decided to choke George. I was I was legitimately worried about him just starting to his like punching in the stomach was his thing. George says the baby is cold after it comes out and Matt rips off his shirt immediately. Gary Graham does not take off his shirt as often as William Shatner does in the original Star Trek. It's come off a few times, but mostly he keeps his shirt on. So this is a rare thing for it to be like some eye candy for the ladies, I guess if you like Gary Graham.

21:52 But George says the baby's cold. Matt rips off his shirt and George says the baby needs the warmth of two bodies and the mother isn't there. So Matt, he essentially is telling him to cuddle close. And Matt, who is always like, part of his job in the show is to mug and make make like faces. Like what's going on now. He doesn't even hesitate. So this episode of a show made in 1990 ends with these two grown men, the human guy, shirtless. He's got a nice hairy man chest holding the pregnant man and the baby on the floor on a mat in a gym, which just.

22:40 Oh my gosh, it's so the redhead that I live with. She, though, obviously freaked out by the delivery scene, which is pretty visceral. She admitted to me the next day that she understands the show's appeal now and that I'm right, that it's good. Oh, OK. Yeah. And she also thinks that she sees maybe why it got cancelled. That scene, you know, you got to swing for the fences. And I think I said the same thing about the end of the last episode that it's you can play it safe to try and stay on the air or you can do stuff that people are going to talk about.

23:17 And they went but talk about. So, you know, having a a tentacle be cuddled in the last episode and having the this man reach into another man's kangaroo pouch and move a baby around. So it's not breach in this episode is plenty to freak people out. But in 1990, I swear to y'all shirtless man holding another man, be it platonically had to have horrified some producers. They must have. I don't know what happened. But yes, very proud of them for going for it. If you put this on TV today, you would hear the word agenda so fast.

23:56 But yeah, that was that was amazing. I'm very impressed. Yeah, and when looking at the entry of it in that book, The Unofficial Guide to Alienation, I'm really surprised they didn't talk more about that because that's one of the things I talked about in the previous episode about how all the producers, in their own unique ways were really freaked out by how controversial the pod transfer was. But I don't think they really said too totally much, if anything, about the the the shirtless scene. And so apparently that either did not freak them out as much or didn't freak the executives out as much.

24:32 And for all the grief that I give Matt, I have to admit he might be a better man than I am in that part. Because it might be one thing for me to take off my shirt to help warm up the baby or to lie. But beside, you know, the man in a platonic way. I don't know if I could do both. You know, I could take the shirt off and put it around the baby. And then somebody said, well, you need to lie next to us. I'm like, OK, fine. But I'm putting my shirt back on. You know, I got to do one or the other. I don't know if I can do both.

24:59 So maybe I'm not a good person. I mean, honestly, once you've, once you've reached into somebody's stomach with your bare hand, I don't know. I mean, Matt was just, yeah, he was a award-winning godfather in this episode. So yes, that was great.

25:15 So I do not have Matt's buddy in my saltwater section of things that I did not like. But this is one of the most caricature negative characters the show has had so far. We've had some pretty silly ones, but this guy takes the cake as like the, hey, what are you talking about? Like guy from out of town, he's all macho at all high 5. And hey, you're a you're a cop, right? Who loves you, baby. You talking to me? He's just like quoting junk. But after they go through everything, Nick from out of town actually gets to like, look at Matt after Matt is saying, you know, why are you going out with this girl who's my neighbor?

25:55 Of course it bothers me. And suddenly he becomes like a human being instead of a ridiculous cartoon character. And he's just like, you know, why are you telling me? Why don't you tell me like Kathy, you know, tell her, man. You know, it's like, oh, OK, suddenly you're a normal human being. You can just talk. So that was actually one of my positives is that, dear heaven, the guy's just like, I'm ridiculous. And even I think you should probably tell her you like her. All right, Well, anything else for sour milk?

26:24 So about roles, Albert asks Matt multiple times for help and insight with the baby shower for George. I'm doing this for the baby shower. I'm doing that for the baby. And Matt is like, I don't care, man. That stuff. I don't care about that. Whatever, napkins, whatever. So Albert picks decorations from Halloween and other completely inappropriate themes because he thinks they're pretty like flamingos instead of storks. And this is ironic because Albert has a great time and everybody at the party seems to have a great time.

26:58 But Matt is frustrated because clearly he does care how you do a baby shower. He just didn't want to say anything because he's, it's so obvious. But I'm man, I don't care about that kind of junk. And then he's get there and he's like, you're doing this wrong. These colors are not right. Albert, these are Halloween decorations, aren't? They colorful. It's a baby shower and and the flamingos are supposed to be storks. I thought these were prettier, so that was a nice continuing. I'm ready for salt water.

27:29 Yeah. I like how when they're discussing the color scheme and George's like, you know, I really like beige. And he and Albert both go beige. Who likes beige? But again, the the tanks and knees are opposite from us. So yeah, of course they're going to love beige. All right, So when it comes to salt water, let me see my first one. Another obvious one. Matt is back to being a caveman with the commentary about everything that makes the tank to knees different. He did such a good job and I think it was just the previous episode being supportive and intrigued by the pod transfer.

28:07 And now he's back to complaining about George's pregnancy and back to being embarrassed about his partner being pregnant. And it's just like, I don't, I don't know, it's when is Matt going to figure it out? It's like, read the room. They're different. Get over it and brace it and and stop comparing and say, oh, you're, you're so different. Oh, but yes, they're different. Did you not figure that out by now? So yeah, that was kind of frustrating. But, you know, not that different from my complaints in other episodes.

28:35 Yeah, it does sound like George broke down in the I don't know, whatever the locker room, they're changing into something or putting on their guns. I have no idea what they do in there since they wear their clothes from home, but yeah, it's like, George, you broke down the locker room. You're going to be OK. Yes. So we had a previous episode where you could use bits of newcomer to make humans younger. So I did not like that in this episode, you could use bits of newcomer to make humans stronger.

29:04 I, I don't want them to use bits of newcomer to get any more superpowers. In fact, in our society we do have this other thing we do where you have a fad that's not based on science at all. And I would have liked it if you just had a steroid. There are plenty of those. And this was being sold as though it was better because it had newcomer bits in it. And maybe it does have newcomer bits in it, but they just have a throwaway line saying no one has proven the newcomer bits do anything. It's just a fad.

29:36 It's like adding rhino horn to something to increase virility. So I would like them to have done that. But since they didn't, newcomer bits do increase your muscle mass, they do give you pretty good superhuman strength. And I just, I'm, I'm putting my foot down about any more newcomer bits giving any more abilities. I really hope they don't do that. Yeah. It would, it would be good if they explore other options. Yeah. And Speaking of that, that's kind of in tune with my next bullet point is that this is at least the third time that we have had a storyline of an old friend or partner of Matt coming back to disrupt life in some way.

30:17 And it usually has something to do with Tank Deniz. And in fact, you just talked about one. It was the something like second or third episode where we meet an old friend of Matt and he's doing the stuff with the Tank Deniz DNA. Then there was another one where we we see his old partner and his partner, you know, does some shady stuff in the episode that Scott kind of screws over George. And when was that episode? The previous episode. So it's like they keep going to the well with, you know, people from Matt's past not being very good.

30:50 Oh, and that's right. I thought of another one this morning. Lump it in there. His own daughter when when she comes in the picture, that's from Matt's past and she's kind of annoying too. It's like as much crap as we give Matt, I'm starting to get the picture that basically everybody from his past sucks and maybe that's why he sucks by association. I can't have a wonder if Matt we're around better people if he would be a better person. So maybe it's not entirely his fault. Nevertheless, I do think they they're going to the well a little too often with people from his past being bad or annoying or or evil or or just misguided in some way, and especially when the last time we had it was last week.

31:32 Yeah, I, I really wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt, and I think I'm on Matt's side more than you are. But unfortunately, with the Big Brother Little Brother episode, we had some strong anecdotal evidence that Matt is a garbage father. And. That's not all his ex wife's fault. They give us plenty of cause to think it was his ex wife's fault and he was the nice normal 1 and she was terrible. No no, we saw him with a kid after that. It's like jeez man he's learning to be his best self and he was not that before.

32:05 So I had had this conversation with you before about how in the episode that might have been the last one, the one where the guy had the ridiculous fake mustache in the Barber chair. Oh yeah, yeah, but. He had a gun and a shoulder harness, like we've seen all the cops do in these modern shows. And it occurred to me that I, I kind of wondered aloud, Are bad guys the only ones who use shoulder harnesses in this universe? So in this episode, Blink and you miss it, But I caught a moment where George did exactly what I suspected this whole time.

32:44 And we can see him pull out his holstered gun and slide it into his jacket pocket. So that is how he's been carrying his guns the whole time. He just puts that holster in his suit jacket pocket. Yay. Oh well, see, I thought that he had been wearing a holster the whole time, but that they were emphasizing this time that because of his bigger belly, he couldn't wear the holster in the usual place. Oh, I like your explanation. That's what they were so much better. They were emphasized I. Hope that's it.

33:18 Yeah, that's. That's much better than what I've got. So we've got a shot. Showrunners, give us one chance. You've got a few episodes left, a little tiny moment of George using a shoulder holster or you're going to show us him slipping into a jacket pocket one more time when he's not pregnant. We will find out, yes. Maybe by the time of the second or third movie, they'll both be moving forward in time and police procedurals and they'll both be using shoulder straps for their guns. But yeah, I have one more negative.

33:49 Do you have any more negatives? Yeah. I've got 2GO. Ahead, do what? OK, so in general, I'm just disappointed that we did not get to see more of George actually being pregnant. I mean, he got the pod just last week and so it seems pretty soon for him to be going into labor. I would like to have seen more of him. Just you don't having to deal with day-to-day life being pregnant. It seemed like they kind of rushed that. I mean, they're trying to emphasize that again, the tanked knees are so different than us because the men can be pregnant.

34:23 But it almost makes us forget that. Susan still carried the pod for quite a while, but that was for several episodes. So in a way she still went longer. And even if there was like a time jump in between episodes, well, still, it was a time jump between episodes off camera. I want to see more on screen time with George being pregnant. And I can't help but wonder if this show had lasted four or five seasons like it should have, would we have seen a a fourth child and George being pregnant again? And maybe they would have done it different the the second time around.

34:59 So yeah, I I wish we had seen more of what we saw this Week 1. Of the strengths of the show, at least with the procedural Cop stuff, has been that they haven't made things linger. So if they have a turning point, they tend to just go ahead and do it. I I agreed with you. I noticed that in my child brain from my iffy memories of these. I just. I assumed that George was pregnant for two or three episodes and Nope, no, it was a an afternoon. Kind of yeah. So we have a sort of showdown in the gym because our junkie steroid user, this big brick of a dude who's clearly a real life bodybuilder because he has a thick accent, his girlfriend tells us that he's essentially just started living at the gym, not as a metaphor, just really living at the gym.

35:51 And so they go to the gym. Now, I just wanted to point out there is no emergency hostage situation. There's no reason that the two police detectives, one of them pregnant, pursue the superhuman roid rage junkie into the gym with the lights off. The lights go out and they're like, we better just keep going. So I'm thinking protocol suggests they step out front into the light, wait for backup. One of them goes around to the back door, gun drawn. I mean, it's just, but no, we have to find a junkie alone in the dark at an empty building right away.

36:28 And that's, that's what they're there to do. So yes, I mean, I he has just killed somebody, but that guy's already dead. No, that guy's not dead either. They have less dead people in these episodes. I think that guy might be in a coma. It was some artificial tension there that me and my pregnant partner have to find this dude in the dark and he's hopped up on steroids. Yeah, and they even showed George going over and trying to flip the lights, but they won't come on. So that I guess somebody turn them off at the circuit breaker or something.

37:01 Yeah. Ripped them out of the wall. Yeah, yeah. And so who would have done that though? The the roid guy? Yep. So even though he was raised, he had enough forethought to say I'm going to go and turn off the lights at the so and so. Yeah, yeah. That. That's kind of weird. Oh yeah, he was. He was pumped. He was ninja monster stalking them. He's a but really quiet about it. That does it for me for negative. OK, all right, I've got one more and it is probably another indication I'm just a terrible person, but that is one ugly baby.

37:38 It looks, it looks like a prop that may have been used in a horror movie. It's just, yeah, I don't know. Now, one interesting thing is that I think we've noticed before that spots, even though they look like they're just pigmentation, it is possible for the spots to either lose pigmentation or to even be either wrinkly or have indentions. And so it is interesting to see that the baby has more ripples in her head in like there aren't spots yet. It's more like ridges that I guess get filled in overtime and whatever the filling is, maybe that is where that extra coloration comes in for the spots.

38:28 And so that's a little bit of interesting visual trivia. Now, don't get me wrong, the mastery in the baby itself is pretty great because obviously it's some kind of puppet or something and it's done very well, but it it doesn't look very angelic for a newborn baby, which grand maybe, you know, newborn babies aren't always that great. I mean, they, they come out, they're scrunched up, they've had a stressful event just happened. They're they're, you know, instantly crying. They're not exactly having their, you know, their first day is not exactly their best day.

39:03 And so I know that that might be realistic too, that, you know, a baby just being born, you know, isn't, you know, maybe still are looking, but still, I just I wish they'd try a little bit hard, especially especially since Matt, who again, we've said is not the most sensitive guy in the world, says, oh, she's beautiful. And I'm like, OK, but yeah, it was a little scary. So. So do you agree? And regardless of whether you want to answer that question or not, am IA terrible person you're. Definitely a terrible person.

39:36 I agree. But yeah, you're a terrible person. No, it's I think you said my point. Let me read into your words that you and I are both digging this scene and how they've put it together. So it's just they lose points for the baby just because it pulls us out of that joy, wonder. Great moment. So so they had some options here and I think the the better choice might have been, you know, a pretty small baby with like paint on its head or a little rubber prop that they do the Ed wood thing where you kind of jiggle it.

40:09 So it's a little rubber arm jiggles. And that might have been a better call. But they went for the full animatronic puppet and it is I think Stan Winston would say it's absolutely beautiful. So that's what I tried to be in touch with is it is an impressive. You already said this. It's an impressive feat of animatronics, and I love that they had the budget for it. That baby might have cost $500,000. Man, that's a crazy puppet. But yes, it was not pretty. So yeah, but I am. I'm going to say Nick wouldn't have brought that up.

40:41 And Todd's just terrible because if I don't say it, you'll, you'll have the robot say it anyway. So I'm just going to say it. Way ahead of you and I'm not a robot, I'm a professional voice over artist. Yeah, and I can't help but wonder if I'm still on something about it being a prop from a horror movie because maybe that is what saved them money because like you said, this show probably doesn't have that high a budget. I can't help but wonder if they did borrow this from a previous production and they just said, OK, mess with the head to make it look alien.

41:12 But it was, you know, actually something from either horror movie or a sci-fi movie or something where the baby didn't need to look stellar. And they're like, OK, that saves us some money because we don't have to do it ourselves. Well, I can't tell you. I mean, the Internet that it, there's a lot of stuff about alienation, but juicy bits like where they got the baby prop from and if they built that fresh or if they got to repurpose it. That's a great question. And alienation, I just don't think it has as deep a following as it should.

41:42 Like maybe just a fraction of what Star Trek has for people to be trying to figure out where every prop came from. So yes, you'll need to write in e-mail us, even if you listen this episode in two years and you'd be like, obviously, here's where the baby came from. I'd be very interested to find out. Yeah. And I thought for sure there would be something about it in that unofficial companion book, but there there wasn't. We're going to research that more later. Mention it in a follow up episode. Where did baby Francisco come?

42:10 Are you ready for connecting the spots? Sort of ready, but I don't have a lot for it to be honest. That's. Fine, I don't either. The first thing in connecting the spots where we look at some comparisons to other shows, maybe in plot, maybe in casting. It's just that in our thesis about losing track of your own gender and the quest for society's version of your gender, our main bad guy juicer his girlfriend tells us that he's pretty much become impotent because he's using steroids. I. Don't know when he'll be back.

42:43 Where was he between midnight and 3:00 AM? I don't know. Lots of times he stays at the gym after he closes up. Lately, he's been staying all night. All right, yeah. At first I thought he was seeing someone else, but no way. Jose for. Me. She's so sure. Well. Let's just say the muscle man act ends between the sheets. I'm sorry I don't follow you. He. Can't perform. You mean he can't sustain an erection? Yeah, George, that's just what she means. He's impotent. Like the only reason he seems to be doing it, a newcomer comes in and lifts weights much better than him, and he goes in the back and loads up even more so he can show off because his girlfriend seemed impressed by this other guy.

43:24 So in his head, he's doing it partly to impress her. But she points out that the two of them are not really hooking up anymore. And like I said already, he's living at the gym now, so they're really, really not together. He's got a beautiful girlfriend, but yeah, that's not going anywhere. And just in the real world, that is one of the side effects of steroids. So they weren't making that up. That's like an actual thing that happens. I think you get like, shrunken legs and stuff, too. But it it does a lot of weird side effects.

43:57 I have a few casting notes. Our guest from out of town, Nick Coletta, Matt's asshat friend from Detroit, he played Hank on 120 episodes of Doctor Quinn, Medicine Woman, which I wouldn't mention except, you know, I think there might be one Doctor Quinter out there who was like, oh, Hank. I, I don't, I've seen 8 episodes and they were great. But yeah, I can't speak to that. And he was in the original RoboCop movie as a creep over to the side. I mean, there's a lot of punks in that movie. So he was punk #2 AD Muyich plays our big bad guy bodybuilder who collapses and attacks Victor Windcos.

44:43 Nothing for him. Like I said, I think they got him off the boat. But the guy who owns the gym who seems like this interesting older human dude personality and we find out he makes his own dietary supplements and stuff. Hank Garrett was in 12 of 14 episodes of Max Headroom. We talked about Max Headroom a lot on this show. I think I heard us mention it briefly in a previous episode. But yeah, if he's in 12 of 14 episodes, he must be one of the evil board members. We see an evil board every now and then or something like, but a lot of these people are not people.

45:22 So if you're wondering if I'll mention the the blonde girlfriend and what she's in, I'm not going to She's not in stuff and not just like not sci-fi. I think a lot of them did not do a lot of it. I think maybe it's the fitness angle. They may have cast fitness people instead of a lot of actors. There's a character named Saul Birnbaum and he's, he's an older gentleman in the episode and he was in Airplane 21 of my personal favorites as Old man #2 and in the famous Twilight Zone movie sequence of Kick the Cam with the Old People, which if you haven't seen it, it's a delight.

46:00 And there is a nurse in this episode, played by Patty Toy. I'm guessing it's that brief bit in the hospital when they're asking the steroid guy where he got it. There's a nurse, and she was in two episodes of Babylon 5. At least one of them. She's playing a Rep for the Cycor. I know enough about the show to know the Cycor, and I think she's over to the side in the movie Speed. And the only other one is a character named Rankin, who I'm not even sure who that. Oh yeah, I do know Rankin, I think is the guy from the last episode who looks like Frank Oz.

46:38 And I think he's the production manager, and they just gave him a walk on part, which I think is adorable. Art Seidel. So it's like, Art, put on this outfit. Come on, be a cop for a scene. He's like, really, you guys? Yeah, Art, go ahead. So yes, that is it for me for connecting the spots. OK the only one I have is that the music being played during the baby shower sounds familiar. It's tink the knees music and no lyrics or anything, and either they've played it once before, or it might be the music that is played near the end of the first TV movie, or maybe both.

47:18 Or maybe I'm imagining things and it came from somewhere else. Or it might just be similar but not the same. But I swear there was something super familiar about that music at the. Time of editing this episode, Nick and Todd have already recorded reviews for the whole season of Alien Nation, and Todd has already viewed all of the TV movies. He says he's pretty sure he's right, that this song is at the end of the first one. Dark Horizon. Well. The in the episode Chains of Love, and I had forgotten about it until you said this, they had that one pop song that was like sung by newcomers in Tank Deniz and I, I'd forgotten totally about it.

47:55 So maybe the people who did that, they were like, throw together something kitschy that we can have playing at the baby shower and they like, went for it. Like just something instrumental, something that, or maybe they're repurposing. Yeah, but it's just, who knows, They got up to something. Yeah, yeah, Yeah. Well, let me see if that's all for connecting the spots. Well, actually, actually I had a question for connecting the spots. So the guy that played the the main steroid type guy, is that one of the ones that you were talking about that didn't have a whole lot of IMDb?

48:27 Yeah. Victor Windcos, yeah. OK. And I didn't know if you knew enough about him to know whether his accent was intentional because he happened to be German or Austrian or something like that, or if it was almost like a spoof of Arnold Schwarzenegger. I believe it is my opinion that he is like, well, Schwarzenegger. When he played Hercules in his first movies, he was like, he described it as fresh off the boat. So I think that there are probably several bodybuilders that came to our country that it's like someone will say, hey, dude, you want to be in a movie.

49:08 So AD Muyich is in three things. Lionheart in 1990, which I think he's probably a fighter. I think that's like a Van Damme movie, something called Hunter in 1984 and Alien nation. And I think that's about it for him. So yes, I think he's cast it's and that's another thing I, I think I might mention it again later, but it's just in the 80s that was our our visual, a really cool fighter was a thick dude with like an extra 110 lbs of straight muscle. It was the the aesthetic and it really changed, I want to say about the time John Mcclane crawled around inside a building and people were like, this is not an action hero.

49:53 What are you guys doing? And America absolutely loved it. So they're like, they don't have to have thick rippling muscles and the aesthetic change. So this show, this episode is like a last episode of that. Yeah. Muyich, he's a stuntman in Lionheart with Van Damme. He's a fighter #2 At one point when I said Hunter, it's, it's the TV show Hunter something, a video called American Revenge. So yes, a very short lived career. I think he spent most of his time just pumping weights and acting was something that they tried, but the truth is nobody likes to admit it.

50:31 Schwarzenegger has a lot of personality. Every once in a while they'll grab a muscly dude and try and give him a career, and it does not work for all of them. The Rock has a crazy amount of personality, but some of them don't. So yeah, he was just a pumped dude in this with a thick accent. I don't think it was intentionally silly or making fun of Schwarzenegger. I think he really does just talk like that. All right, all right, well, I guess we'll move on to the Albert Einstein Award, but maybe we should just skip it because seriously, I don't think there was an example this week, so we.

51:05 Have two chances, OK and neither of them are on screen. They in order to make super steroids with bits of newcomer in it. So you know, it's good. They have two blood donors that we see their names listed and we don't see the guys and one of them is John Adams and the other one is Ramon Navarro. And both of these are people. So we have to choose between Ramon Navarro, who is a famous Mexican silent film actor, even though we'd have to look it up. So do we give points to him for diversity or do we give it to John Adams, our statesman and 2nd president?

51:48 Or you know what? None of y'all deserve it because you weren't even in the episode. What do you think? Oh, yeah. So I didn't even notice. And you said it's like, what? Just to mention we don't see these people. Yeah, they. They have the names of two blood donors who are newcomers, and those are that I. Mean, I guess if we got to give it to somebody, John Adams, because at least that one is super obvious. But yeah, I it is. It is good that you caught that. I missed it somehow. I was. Trying so hard and there are a lot of people in this episode that are just human lame.

52:23 So, yeah, not a lot to work with. So John Adams, 2nd president, you are winner of the Albert Einstein Award. And and honestly, Ramon Navarro, I don't know who in the audience was like, Oh my gosh, like the famous Mexican silent film actor. But, you know, I hope you enjoyed that moment, listener, if that was your thing, I'm proud of you. I'm impressed. So we are ready for I have to talk about this. If you have anything left you haven't gotten to mention, I've got like 2. But yeah, what do you got?

52:54 All right, so a few things from that unofficial companion book that I've mentioned several times already. Producer Tom Chahack said he lost a lot of battles in the writers room about the way this episode handled George's pregnancy. He felt the episode was just quote, mimicking the stereotype of a pregnant woman, UN quote, and he was bothered by the tone of the whole piece. But he explains that majority rules. So the rest of the writers, I guess must have liked it, is what he was suggesting. Let me see.

53:27 Eric Pierpoint said he had fun with the episode. For research. He talked to a lot of women about their childbirth experiences. He said one of his all time favorite scenes was when Georges ticked off at Matt at work and Justice fusses with stuff on his desk and knocks something out of Matt's hand. So apparently he really had a lot of fun with that scene. Gary Graham said that he and Eric decide to really commit to the labor scene. And while you were talking about something about the cast, I was skimming through the paragraphs of this entry on trying to find more about the baby.

54:03 And I do vaguely remember either Gary Grammar or Eric Carepoint say it. Yeah, it was kind of fun with the special effects and the pouch was fake and we had ooze on the baby and everything, but they never come around and say exactly what the baby is. And so again, I'm surprised that bit of trivia isn't in there. And so then the last thing is that Eric said that when George tells Matt to breathe and later says that Vesna has Susan's spots, those were actually ad libs. Oh yeah, wow. Yeah, so that's how committed they were to the scene is they they kind of got into it and actually it said some things that weren't even in the script, so.

54:43 Well, OK, so as an excuse to talk about Star Trek The Next Generation, it was pointed out to me there's an episode later in the show where it felt like either the writers or the actors or both were adding callbacks to previous episodes as though they really cared, just as little trivia. So like there's an A Berkeley episode where Deanna Troi, our counselor, tells the uptight character to do this pressure point tap behind his ear when he gets frustrated or something, and it's a throwaway thing. And a bunch of us left that week tapping behind our ear.

55:16 Yeah. To see if it worked. And this episode is like two seasons later, and someone is talking to Deanna Troy about her mom or something. And what does she do? But she reaches up and starts tapping behind her ear. So what you're describing, where an actor is like, you know what? The baby's named Vesna. Let's talk a little about Vesna. Let's just have a moment. And that's that's cool. You know, reading of the script, add something real that counts. They could have just said, hey, George, you know, she's got your, your, your wife's spots, you know, or something.

55:51 But you know, he's like, no, no baby has a name. You're the godfather. So that's really cool. I did like that they mentioned that the baby is named Vesna. And this is from the Uncle Moodri episode with the Magic Box that we saw previously where he was saying it's traditional to name the baby after the mother's mother, I think, but or maternal grandmother or something. So yeah, that's. I like that they remembered it and I like that they brought it up. That was cool. When the case seems to go nowhere and there really isn't that much of a case.

56:23 Who gave you the steroids? We got it on the street. No, I mean, they're making it. It's like there is nobody else. You've already caught the bad guy at the beginning. He's the one who passed out. But Grazer tells them, forget about this case, it's a dead case and he wants to put them on a gambling ring out of Palach clubs. And I just, I liked that they mentioned Palach again. So it's a kind of newcomer wrestling that was first mentioned and shown in Episode 6, the first cigar. We haven't seen it since and it looked CD.

56:54 But George seemed to respect the sport. And in Episode 11, Chains of Love. It's one newcomer's hobby on his dating profile, so there must be gems as well as underground clubs. It definitely felt like gambling was going on in that warehouse where we saw it in the first cigar. So an underground watch club and that's it for me, OK. So the only thing left for me is wheel of press kit. So let me spin the wheel and let's see what I can read from the press kit. And OK, so I'll read a little snippet from the profile for Michelle Scarabelli, who plays Susan Francisco.

57:35 Born in Montreal, Michelle spent the first three years of her childhood in Venezuela, where she acquired a child to fluency in Spanish. In her professional life, Michelle Scarabelli overcame her childhood shyness the moment she stood in front of a still camera. Initially, this is a quote. Initially, I had a lot of fun modeling, but after a while, the routine of giving the camera the same looks with the same face seemed depleting. And there's still a stigma attached to coming from a modeling background.

58:09 And Michelle's determination has certainly turned the stigma into an advantage. After appearing in regional Montreal productions of The One Time Woman or Excuse Me One Woman drama tape recorder with the Montreal Actors Studio and chamber music with the prestigious Centaur Theatre, Michelle relocated to Toronto where she developed her comedic skills during a year long stint with the world renowned Second City Workshop. What? Yeah, the move to Toronto brought Michelle her first television feature, the CBC film Labor of Love, where she played an Acadian woman frustrated by small town life.

58:53 Oh my gosh. So I take it from your reaction that you're familiar with Second City then, right? Well. I mean, so Catherine O'Hara passed away recently. So the idea of Second City TVI think it's actually coming back to a streamer. It is, if you all haven't seen it, it's a little like Saturday Night Live, just maybe a little less polished and a little weirder. But yeah, this is this is where a lot of our favorite people got their start, including Catherine O'Hara. So I love the idea of coming across Michelle Scarabelli on there.

59:23 That's that's really cool. OK, And while you're talking, I went ahead and spun the wheel again. So this time I get a little bit of trivia about the date, time and normal time slot that comes from the quasi fake newspaper Alien Times that was at the front of the press kit. And this is from the portion of that quasi fake newspaper that I think is more real than fake. And this must have been in my notes for a while because I actually paraphrased this one so I wouldn't have to read anything. The article says that the pilot movie would air from 9:00 to 11:00 PM on Monday 18th of September of 1989.

1:00:07 And I found that interesting because Fox is a 2 hour primetime network, they don't go to the 10:00 hour. So I thought the fact this went from 9:00 to 11:00 was kind of weird. So I'm guessing that they either had special permission from local affiliates to go past 10:00 PM, or it could be that that was an early plan that got changed. Because I think there's another part of this press kit that says that it would premiere at 8. So maybe it's either a misprint or a plans change or something like that.

1:00:37 But anyway, the show's normal time slot was planned for Mondays at 9 starting September 25th, the very next week. But the article also says that some viewers would get the chance to meet the real Francisco family as Fox had plans for a nationwide tour. And so, and again, I paraphrase this, I haven't looked at the the main article recently, so I'm not sure if they explained that nationwide tour. But I guess they went like on an actual press tour where they were talking about the show saying this is a show that's coming and doing interviews.

1:01:13 And again, it says plans for a nationwide tour. How they actually went through it or not isn't clear either. But yeah. Anyway, just a little bit of trivia on the time slot of the show. Nationwide tour the Francisco family. That is crazy. If Todd and I redo the entire show in a few years under assumed names, we're going to have so much more information. But yes, that's that's epic, man. The press kit has a bunch of cool stuff in it. I have to look up Labor of Love later, but I had already scanned a lot of these cast members repertoires for anything that jumped out at me.

1:01:54 But that means I missed a bunch of stuff. So now occasionally I'll go back and look and be like, what? She's in what? So yes, there's some interesting stuff there. Cool. I think. Let me see, We're ready for scoring it, all right? Well, I usually give a Star Trek Alumni score or an STA. This episode has a base for for Sykes, Mr. and Mrs. Francisco, and Captain Grazer, who are in a lot of the episodes, but no one else. I think an STA score of 4 is as low as we've ever been. So these are dark times indeed.

1:02:32 Friends, that is who, if you guys are coming for the Star Trek alumni, try not to turn off the show now because I'm sure more will come. But I also rate episodes on a watch skip basis. And this is another episode that's amazingly progressive for its time, but also for today. Todd and I are watching it in the time when heterosexual men can win competition shows and cooking, fashion and dance, but we're still not supposed to show certain feelings or act certain ways. But for 1990, I mean, wow, you have to watch this one because even though we've mostly moved past the Schwarzenegger physique, it's amazingly pro authenticity, pro gender on a spectrum.

1:03:12 And like I said before, it's amazing how horrified some elements of our society would be by parts of this episode today. So I guess you need to see it just because it's daring, very daring in messaging and everything. What did you think, Todd? I already kind of hinted at this at the beginning. This episode was a great episode. It is definitely one of the best, but I think I was hoping for a little bit more. And I think I'm starting to realize that a lot of my memories of watching this show before and the reason it ranks so high amongst my favorite science fiction TV shows is mostly because of certain scenes.

1:03:50 And this episode has one of the best scenes, the childbirth scene, but the rest of the episode isn't as good. And not that it's bad, it's just, you know, we're kind of waiting for that final scene and I can't, I might have explained this in the previous episode, but I feel it's a little bit of the Up effect where the Pixar movie Up has like 3 great things in it and everybody remembers that, those 3 great things, but then they almost forget the plot. I think this is another episode that kind of suffers from the Up effect.

1:04:20 Despite all that, in spite our little nitpicks and everything, it is still great and I do still give it an A minus but I was hoping looking for that a or a plus. Well, then again, next disclaimer, an A minus is a pretty big deal for Todd everybody. So that's a that's high praise. Yeah, In fact, I'm starting to wonder if I should go back and like re watch some of these and recalibrate because I'm like, I think I was being too tough on the show early on because I thought surely that A that will have there be plenty of A's and and maybe even a plus or two along the way.

1:04:52 And and now that that is not quite getting there, I'm like someone might be B minuses early on should have been B's or maybe even B pluses. I don't know we're. Going to re evaluate later, but yes. So join us coming up next time on alienating ourselves as we explore Alienation's 18th episode, Crossing the Line. Francisco worries that Sykes is hiding something when he cancels his vacation plans to help track down a killer. So this description is really vague and I haven't watched it yet because I watch them when you guys do.

1:05:28 But based on past experience, of course Matt's hiding something. Todd already knows what it is. But you and I will find out together next time. On alienating ourselves, I continue to be Nick Frutiger. I'm Todd, thank you for listening to us while you buff up at the gym. We'd love to see some reviews where you listen to podcasts. If you love us, like us, or can barely tolerate us, please give us five stars. If you go so far as to do steroids just to punch us in the face harder, please give us four stars.

1:05:57 If you give us three stars or lower, you just ain't man enough. As as always, may all your milk be as fresh or as sour as you prefer it to be. And always, always, always wait until a person confirms they are actually pregnant before asking when the baby is due. A stand up comedian I used to listen to learn that the hard way. Let's not make the same mistake he did. Have a great week. Goodnight everybody.